Re: Armageddon = great tribulation

So do you think that the 7 times of Daniel are about 1914 after all? I think it's quite hard to believe it because there are so many problems with that interpretation and chronology.

How about the prophecy of Joel 2:28,29 in relation to Matthew 24:14? E-watchman thinks that the real preaching work wont be done until the spirit has been poured and the Kingdom established. What do you think of that idea?

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Don't you find it interesting that historians, writing about the twentieth century, say that this past century was unique in many, many ways from all previous ones? And they don't base their observation on the 7 times of Daniel. They have not studied Bible chronology in order to reach their conclusions. It's about looking at actual events, discerning why they happened, trying to understand the underlying causes and becoming aware how it has affected the fabric of society, yes, reaching down to the very family unit. And trying to predict where mankind is heading.

When Jesus gave his sign concerning the destruction of Jerusalem, he did not base his prophecies on chronology, but rather on certain events that would take place, such as, "when YOU see Jerusalem surrounded by encamped armies, then know that the desolating of her has drawn near." (Luke 21:20) Since survival was dependent on obedience, that prophecy was clear to understand, for everyone. It was not a matter of looking to someone with "special insight" to figure out how many more years Bible chronology revealed before Jerusalem was surrounded by encamped armies, and then destroyed, was it?

The Society has had many books printed over the decades attempting to interpret Bible prophecies, especially the fascinating part of chronology. Russell started with the seven volumes of Studies in the Scriptures. We don't study those anymore. They were replaced by other, more up-to-date books. In the 1960's we studied "Babylon the Great Has Fallen, God's Kingdom Rules", several times. That was replaced with the more recent book on Revelation, which we have also studied many times. The same can be said about the books of Daniel, Ezekiel, Isaiah, Joel and many others. Are we any closer to understanding these prophecies, especially chronology, except for the fact that Jehovah will judge his people and also bless them? If the Watchtower has been wrong on the matter of chronology and certain other prophecies, what makes you think that e-watchman has got it any better? E-watchman believes that the "time of the end" is still future. The prophet Daniel was told to "make secret the words and seal up the book, until the time of the end." (Daniel 12:4,9) What makes e-watchman, or anybody else for that matter, think that they can unseal and understand the book before the time of the end? Is that not being presumptuous? Is that not why we are warned against false prophets?

Take the simple matter of "the greatest of all tribulations" that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 24:21, 22. Is that a man-made tribulation? That is what e-watchman claims. He says, "The great tribulation is different than Armageddon. The tribulation is caused by man, which will no doubt manifest itself in world war three. Armageddon involves heavenly forces."
http://e-jehovahs-witnesses.com/viewtopic.php?p=58823&sid=ea0b56ee7e0a6ce43616820793b1102a#58823

Is that not similar to what the Watchtower at one time taught for many decades, that the great tribulation is man-made and started with World War One, in 1914; that it was cut short because the number of the chosen ones had not then been completed and that it was going to resume at Armageddon? Of course, the Society no longer teaches that. Now, according to e-watchman, instead of the great tribulation starting with the first world war, he believes it will be a future third world war. Time will tell if he is any closer to the truth on his interpretation than the Watchtower was.

Can anything be more devastating, more severe, more destructive than the great tribulation, if it is, as Jesus describes it as "such as has not occurred since the world's beginning until now, no, nor will occur again. In fact, unless those days were cut short, no flesh would be saved." Does that not describe what Zephaniah wrote? He said, "Neither their silver nor their gold will be able to deliver them in the day of Jehovah’s fury; but by the fire of his zeal the whole earth will be devoured, because he will make an extermination, indeed a terrible one, of all the inhabitants of the earth.” (Zephaniah 1:18) Will anyone survive without divine protection? (Rev. 7:14) Do you also believe that this greatest of all tribulations is caused by man, as "world war three", whereas Armageddon is brought on by Jehovah? Any scriptural support? or is that based on interpretation of prophecies that are made "secret and sealed up" until the time of their fulfillment? (Acts 1:7) What if the great tribulation actually is Armageddon? (I believe that the term "Armageddon" refers specifically to the part where Jehovah destroys the nations, but it is all part of the one great tribulation. It is the same as "Jehovah's day" mentioned in Bible prophecies.) Won't those, who look to e-watchman for guidance, be caught by surprise as events will not develop as he has laid it out?

Another very dangerous interpretation is the one you mention, that the preaching work, that Jesus speaks of in Matthew 24:14, is still future. Please reason on this: E-watchman also believes that God's judgment will start with his own house, his people. (1 Peter4:17) After God has judged the members of his house and has identified the faithful slave, and has removed the things causing stumbling and persons doing lawlessness, will he then, soon after judge them again? (Matt. 13:39-43) Even e-watchman does not think so, at least not that I am aware of. Yet, he teaches that the preaching work comes during or soon after the great tribulation, and that the great crowd will form during that time. Will God judge his household after the great tribulation or before? If the judging is done before the tribulation then many who trust e-watchman will be caught off guard, for there will be no longer any opportunity to preach or take sides with Jehovah after the judging has started. Then it will be too late for those still in Babylon the Great to flee, for they will not have heeded the warning to "get out of her" before the hour of judgment upon her has arrived. (Rev. 18:4) Yes, after Jehovah has judged his own house he will immediately after that turn his attention on Babylon the Great. This of course, does not agree with the way e-watchman lays it out, for he believes that God's people must first be taken into captivity by Babylon the Great.

Now is the time to be busy in the preaching work, while we still have time. The opportunity will soon be gone. By means of the preaching Jehovah is still, at this time, bringing into his household many who are seeking the true God. Any of them, who might still be in Babylon the Great, must get out of her and become sons and daughters to Jehovah before he starts the judgment with his own house. (2 Cor. 6:14-18) For all who survive the great tribulation will have been first judged favorably as his people. After the judging of his own household Jehovah will then turn his attention on Babylon the Great, totally devastating her, after which he will war with the nations. This scenario is clearly laid out in the scriptures. There is nothing secretive or mysterious about it. Because our lives are at stake it is plain to understand, and we do not need anyone to interpret it for us. What is secret and mysterious are the many details leading up to all of this. But Jehovah has included these, not in order to confuse us, but rather to prove, after everything has been accomplished, that he is the true God who can foretell the beginning from the finale. (Isaiah 46:9-11) It is these details that many self proclaimed prophets are seizing on to "explain", in order to promote themselves by claiming special insight. (Matt. 7:15; Mark 13:22; 2 Peter 2:1-3) We only have ourselves to blame if we fall victim to them. (Mark 13:23)

”You also must be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour and a moment when you do not anticipate it.” —Luke 12:40, Amplified Bible.

(If I have misunderstood e-watchman's position on anything I have said I beg you to please correct me.)

Re: Prophecies we need to understand

. . . I’d like to know what your thoughts are on. . . the identity of the king of the north and king of the south. I don’t see you mention it anywhere. . .

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I do mention in my essay on “Prophecies We Need to Understand . . . and those we don’t”, that there are prophecies that are made secret and sealed up by God, until the time of the end, or the time of their fulfillment. The prophecies in the book of Daniel are among those. (Daniel 12:4,9)

Concerning the identities of the king of the north and the king of the south, the book “Pay Attention to Daniel’s Prophecy!” [dp] (published by Jehovah’s witnesses) says on page 284, “The prophecy in Daniel chapter 11 does not foretell the names of the political entities that occupy the positions of the king of the north and the king of the south at various times. Their identities become known only after the events start to occur.” (footnote)

In his prophecies Jehovah has written history in advance and we can understand the fulfillment of them only when the events are happening or later, when we get to see the full picture. Any attempt to interpret them ahead of time is sheer speculation, as we cannot take into account the many unforeseeable and unpredictable events that may have a direct impact on the fulfillment of any prophecy, such as the destruction by terrorists of the Twin Towers of the World Trade Center, in New York, on September 11, 2001. It was unforeseen and it remains to be seen to what extent it plays a role in Bible prophecy, if any.

Having said that, though, we should be able to at least interpret the part of prophecy correctly that has already undergone fulfillment. But it seems that we cannot even get that right. Take for example what the Watchtower has said about the identities of the king of the north and the king of the south. Who are they today? Who was the king of the north in the first century?

“. . . in 65 B.C. the Roman General Pompey the Great dethroned the last one, Antíochus XIII Asiaticus; and in 64 B.C. Syria became a Roman province. There definitely Rome took up the role of the king of the north. Before this king of the north Jerusalem fell in 63 B.C. The Egyptian king of the south was powerless to prevent it. . .
. . . With good reason, then, Jehovah’s angel included the important mention of this in the vision to Daniel, so as to aid us also in determining when the prophetic “king of the north” changed from Syrian kings of the fifth world power to Roman rulers of the sixth world power.” (w59 12/1 p. 730-31, Part 27: “Your Will Be Done on Earth”)

The Roman rulers succeeded the Syrian kings as the “king of the north” when it became the sixth world power. Who replaced Rome and became the seventh world power, according to Bible prophecy?

”The seed for the Anglo-American World power was actually planted by the Roman Empire a long time ago. According to Biblical history, the Roman Empire was the sixth world power in a series that began with ancient Egypt, or the fourth counting from Babylon. As foretold, the Anglo-American world power, described as a ‘horn speaking grandiose things,’ was to spring from the Roman Empire. (Dan. 7:7, 8, 23, 24) How did this prove to be so?
When the Roman armies arrived in Britain in the first century before our Common Era, they made Britain part of the Roman Empire. Thus the sixth world power became firmly established there with its local capital at Camulodunum, which is now Colchester. Before the Romans came, the land was divided among approximately thirty tribes of people. After these tribes were subdued, the area constituted the western division of the Roman European provinces.
Under Roman protection Britain prospered, approximately ninety-two towns rising there. Acknowledging this Roman domination of Britain as the beginning of the history of Great Britain, the book The Historians’ History of the World by Henry Smith Williams states: “The history of Great Britain may be said to begin with the landing of Caesar’s legions on the southern shore of England.” Thus we see the link between the Roman Empire and the Anglo-American or seventh world power.” (g70 12/8 p. 21 The Rise of the Anglo-American World Power)

If Great Britain and America replaced the Roman Empire as the next world power according to the scriptures, and thus became the Seventh World Power, did they also replace Rome as the king of the north? Please consider what Jehovah inspired the prophet Daniel to write about the “king of the north.”

⁴⁰ “And in the time of [the] end the king of the south will engage with him in a pushing, and against him the king of the north will storm with chariots and with horsemen and with many ships; and he will certainly enter into the lands and flood over and pass through. ⁴¹ He will also actually enter into the land of the Decoration, and there will be many [lands] that will be made to stumble. But these are the ones that will escape out of his hand, Edom and Moab and the main part of the sons of Ammon. ⁴² And he will keep thrusting out his hand against the lands; and as regards the land of Egypt, she will not prove to be an escapee. ⁴³ And he will actually rule over the hidden treasures of the gold and the silver and over all the desirable things of Egypt. And the Libyans and the Ethiopians will be at his steps. —Daniel 11:40-43.

Note, please, how it is foretold that the king of the north would storm with chariots and with horsemen and with many ships, and enter into the land of the Decoration (The splendid kingdom of Augustus included “the land of the Decoration”—the Roman province of Judea. - dp chap. 14 p. 233 The Two Kings Change Identities). He would come into Egypt and “actually rule over the hidden treasures of the gold and the silver and over all the desirable things of Egypt.”

When did this happen?

”Great Britain took on imperial power in the beginning of the seventeenth century and rose to the position of the seventh world power of Bible history, it being joined in this position by the United States of America to form the Anglo-American dual world power. During Britain’s war with Napoleon Bonaparte the British army drove the French out of Egypt, the whole of which the French had conquered in 1798. Although Egypt came again under the overlordship of Turkey, the British government virtually controlled Egypt since 1882. Egypt was in fact a British dependency, although under its native khedive, for the British army stayed in Egypt and the British will was really the law. Then in 1914, because the Egyptian khedive sided with Turkey, which had joined Germany in the first world war, the British took over in Egypt, deposed the khedive and declared Egypt a British Protectorate.” (w60 1/1 p. 27 Part 29: “Your Will Be Done on Earth”)

”It is true that during World War I the British expeditionary forces carried on a military campaign in Palestine against Turkey, and on December 9, 1917, Jerusalem was captured by the British General Allenby. After the war the newly begun League of Nations assigned to Britain the mandate over Palestine, to continue till May 14, 1948.” (w59 9/15 p. 570 Part 22: “Your Will Be Done on Earth”)

The prophet Daniel foretold that the king of the north would come into the land of the Decoration (Judea) and into Egypt, and rule over the hidden treasures. Isn’t this what Britain did? It was Britain that redrew the map and carved up the Middle East, including Palestine, into the various Arab countries that we have today. The conflicts in that region are the direct result of this, with far-reaching consequences for the king of the north, the Anglo-American world power.

Why, though, does the Watchtower claim that “democratic Britain and America came into the position of the king of the south”? (w60 1/1 p. 27 Part 29: “Your Will Be Done on Earth”) Because of the above reasons. Their reasoning is that when the British went into Egypt and Palestine it made Britain the king of the south, because Egypt is south of the land of Daniel’s people, the land of the Decoration. But did Jehovah’s prophet not foretell that it would be the king of the north doing that? By that same logic the Roman Empire also should have come “into the position of the king of the south” when it came into the land of Decoration, and Judea came directly under Roman domain in 63 B.C.E., and when Octavian annexed Egypt in 31 B.C.E. (dp chap. 14 p. 248 The Two Kings Change Identities) The king of the north is clearly the Anglo-American seventh world power. Is not the king of the north still carrying on his campaign and actively ruling over the hidden treasures, oil, in that region, the middle east, willing to defend his interest there at all cost, as prophesied by Daniel the prophet?

If the Anglo-American world power is in reality the king of the north, who then is the king of the south?

”In 642 C.E., the Egyptian capital, Alexandria, fell to the Saracens (Arabs), and Egypt became a province of the caliphs. In January 1449, Constantine XI became the last emperor of the east. Ottoman Turks under Sultan Mehmed II took Constantinople on May 29, 1453, ending the Eastern Roman Empire. The year 1517 saw Egypt become a Turkish province.” (dp chap. 14 The Two Kings Change Identities)

The Ottoman Empire was an imperial power that existed from 1299 to 1923 (634 years), one of the largest empires to rule the borders of the Mediterranean Sea. At the height of its power, it included Anatolia, the Middle East, part of North Africa, Spain, and south-eastern Europe, including Greece and north up to “the gates of Vienna”.

Says the Wikipedia encyclopedia,”In the 16th and 17th centuries, the Ottoman Empire was among the world's most powerful political entities and the countries of Europe felt threatened by its steady advance through the Balkans. From 1517 onwards, the Ottoman Sultan was also the Caliph of Islam, and the Ottoman Empire was from 1517 until 1922 (or 1924) synonymous with the Caliphate, the Islamic State.” (From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Empire

In “the time of the end” is there still an Islamic State(s) that is engaged in a “pushing” with the king of the north? What provokes the king of the north to “go forth in a great rage in order to annihilate and to devote many to destruction”? 9/11? Has he already gone forth? (Daniel 11:40-44) Time will eventually give us the full picture.

► Added Feb. 28, 2006: There is some interesting and helpful information posted on e-Jehovah’s Witnesses forum (Paradise Café) by a member, Ebed, regarding the King of the North and King of the South. Click on the Link to view it [posted Feb 23 2006, 01:35 AM].
http://e-jehovahs-witnesses.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=740&st=13 (Let me know if the Link doesn’t work for one reason or another)

Bro Perimeno, I read your article on What Went Wrong and am somewhat confused by your statement: “Whom does Israel actually picture? It pictures neither the anointed nor the world. It pictures all (the good and the bad) who like ancient Israel claim to be in a covenant relationship with Jehovah.”

If it pictures all who claim to be in a covenant relationship with Jehovah, does that not mean it pictures the anointed and all in the world who, including the Jews and Christendom, claim to be in a covenant with God? Are you not contradicting yourself? What about the great crowd of Rev? They do not claim to be in a covenant. Could they be pictured by Israel?

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Actually, the article “What Went Wrong” was contributed by brother Jim Wheeler, editor of the 2001 Translation, an American English Bible. http://www.2001translation.com Since I am in agreement with most of what he says in his document I agreed to post it on my website.

As for your question, the easy way out for me would be to direct you to brother Wheeler for the answer. (editor@2001translation.com ) But I would like to share some of my thoughts on the point you raise.

As brother Wheeler points out, ancient Israel was in a covenant with Jehovah, made at Mt. Sinai. The covenant was made only between God and the natural descendents of Abraham, with whom Jehovah had made a covenant over four hundred years earlier. (Gen. 22:16-18; Ex. 31:17,18; Deut. 4:37; 7:6-8; Psalms 147:19,20; Amos 3:1,2; Rom. 3:1,2)

The Law covenant included a separate “covenant with the tribe of Levi, that the entire tribe should be set aside to constitute the tabernacle service organization, including the priesthood.” Priestly duties were confined to the male members of Aaron’s family, while the remaining families of Levi were taking care of other duties, such as setting up the tabernacle, moving it, and other matters. Later, they served likewise at the temple. (see Insight On The Scriptures, page 523)

Please note that the entire nation of Israel, all twelve tribes, were in a covenant with Jehovah, and from among them he chose one tribe and concluded a separate covenant with them, a covenant for the priesthood. From the very beginning Jehovah had purposed to replace the covenant made at Mt. Sinai with a new and better covenant, for his promise to Abraham included that all nations of the earth would eventually be blessed by means of his seed. (Jeremiah 31:31-34; Gal. 3:8) The Law covenant, made at Mount Sinai, became “our tutor leading to Christ,” the promised seed. Once the seed arrived this covenant became obsolete. (Gal. 3:16,24; Heb. 8:13)

Just as Aaron served as high priest on behalf of the people, so Jesus has become our high priest. (Ex. 28:1-3; Heb. 4:14; 5:4,5) And in the same way that Aaron had priests serving under him so too Jesus has those who serve as priests under him, 144,000, each one of whom has been chosen by God. (Rom. 8:28-30; 9:11,16; 1 Peter 2:4,5,9; Rev. 14:1; 20:6) Since Jehovah chose the priesthood from among the twelve tribes of the sons of Israel, specifically the tribe of Levi, from among whom does he choose the 144,000? We are told:

”And I heard the number of those who were sealed, a hundred and forty-four thousand, sealed out of every tribe of the sons of Israel . . .” —Revelation 7:4.

It goes on to list some of the twelve tribes of Israel. (verses 5-8; the tribe of Dan is not mentioned while Manasseh, the son of Joseph, is listed along with his father.) These cannot mean the literal tribes of natural Israel for the apostle Paul tells us that Jehovah grafted Gentiles into the symbolic “garden olive tree”, which tree pictures the 144,000. (Romans 11:17-24) Then who are these tribes of the sons of Israel in Revelation?

Jehovah had originally purposed to choose the full number of the 144,000 “branches” from among Abraham’s natural descendents, the Jews. But after they rejected his son Jehovah ended their special relationship with him and he determined to replace some of the natural branches with wild branches, from among people of the nations. (Romans 9:3-8) Since it was not due to any birthright or works of law that Jehovah made the promise to Abraham, but rather due to his exemplary faith, likewise Jehovah could fulfill his promise to Abraham by means of those who exercise faith like Abraham, declaring them also righteous because of their faith. (Gen. 15:6; see Romans 4:1-4,13,14) This is what John the Baptist was referring to when he addressed the crowds coming to him:

” ⁷ Therefore he began to say to the crowds coming out to be baptized by him: “YOU offspring of vipers, who has intimated to YOU to flee from the coming wrath? ⁸ Therefore produce fruits that befit repentance. And do not start saying within yourselves, ‘As a father we have Abraham.’ For I say to YOU that God has power to raise up children to Abraham from these stones. ” —Luke 3:8. (see also John 8:39,40; Rom. 4:1-3,13,16,17; Gal. 3:18)

Further on this, the apostle Paul writes:

” ⁷ Surely YOU know that those who adhere to faith are the ones who are sons of Abraham. ⁸ Now the Scripture, seeing in advance that God would declare people of the nations righteous due to faith, declared the good news beforehand to Abraham, namely: “By means of you all the nations will be blessed.” ⁹ Consequently those who adhere to faith are being blessed together with faithful Abraham.” —Galatians 3:7-9.

It is clear that Jehovah considers those who have faith like Abraham to be Abraham’s sons. That is why Paul writes, “For not all who [spring] from Israel are really ‘Israel.’” (Rom. 9:6) Therefore, the tribes of the sons of Israel, in Revelation chapter seven, refers to all those who become Abraham’s sons by reason of their faith in Jehovah and his son, Christ Jesus. From among them Jehovah chooses and seals the members of the 144,000, who will rule as kings and priests with Christ. (Rev. 5:9,10) Jehovah chooses them only from among those who have been brought into the new covenant with him. He anoints them and makes a separate covenant with them, like he did with the priests in Moses’ time. (Lev. 8:2,12,30) And in the same way that Jehovah anointed David of Israel, and made a covenant with him, so too Jesus makes a covenant for a kingdom with those whom his father has anointed. (1 Sam. 10:1; 16:13; 2 Sam. 7:16; Luke 22:29,30) They were all chosen and anointed from among God’s covenant people.

You mention the great crowd of Revelation. (7:9-17) Are they in the new covenant? And are they also pictured by the sons of Israel in the same chapter?

Concerning the great crowd we are told:

⁹ After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, dressed in white robes; and there were palm branches in their hands. ¹⁰ And they keep on crying with a loud voice, saying: “Salvation [we owe] to our God, who is seated on the throne, and to the Lamb.”

¹³ And in response one of the elders said to me: “These who are dressed in the white robes, who are they and where did they come from?” ¹⁴ So right away I said to him: “My lord, you are the one that knows.” And he said to me: “These are the ones that come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. ¹⁵ That is why they are before the throne of God; and they are rendering him sacred service day and night in his temple; and the One seated on the throne will spread his tent over them. ¹⁶ They will hunger no more nor thirst anymore, neither will the sun beat down upon them nor any scorching heat, ¹⁷ because the Lamb, who is in the midst of the throne, will shepherd them, and will guide them to fountains of waters of life. And God will wipe out every tear from their eyes.” —Rev. 7:9,10,13-17.

The great crowd is seen as dressed in white robes. That is because “they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb” (blood of the covenant). Their white robes signify that they are clean, undefiled, because Jehovah has forgiven their sins due to their faith in the ransom, the blood of the covenant, which was “poured out in behalf of many for forgiveness of sins.” (Matt. 26:28) Their names have been inscribed in the book of life and thus they will “come out of the great tribulation,” having survived it. (Rev. 3:4,5)

Are they in the new covenant? Would they be able to appear before the throne of God and render him “sacred service day and night in his temple,” if they were not? Has anyone ever been able to render sacred service to God in his temple without being in a covenant relationship with him? The Ammonites, Moabites, Edomites, Midianites, for example were all related to God’s people, but they were not in a covenant with him. As such, could they render any kind of sacred service to God in his temple? (Deut. 23:3) Even God’s own people, who were in a covenant with him, could not render to God sacred service that was not prescribed by him. Please consider the examples of Nadab and Abihu, Korah, Dathan, Abiram, and king Uzziah. (Lev. 10:1,2; Ex. 30:9; Num. 16:5-7,16-35; 2 Chron. 26:18)

For the great crowd to be able to render sacred service to Jehovah in his temple means that their sacred service is acceptable to him. He is their God and they are his people, and they are in the new covenant with him, because as he foretold through the prophet Jeremiah in connection with the new covenant, ³³ “For this is the covenant that I shall conclude with the house of Israel after those days,” is the utterance of Jehovah. “I will put my law within them, and in their heart I shall write it. And I will become their God, and they themselves will become my people.”

³⁴ “And they will no more teach each one his companion and each one his brother, saying, ‘KNOW Jehovah!’ for they will all of them know me, from the least one of them even to the greatest one of them,” is the utterance of Jehovah. “For I shall forgive their error, and their sin I shall remember no more.” (Jeremiah 31:31-34)

Jesus, by means of his shed blood, enables the great crowd to have a clean conscience before God and thus they can render sacred service to him. That is only possible if they are in the new covenant. Note how the apostle Paul makes that point:

” ¹³ For if the blood of goats and of bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who have been defiled sanctifies to the extent of cleanness of the flesh, ¹⁴ how much more will the blood of the Christ, who through an everlasting spirit offered himself without blemish to God, cleanse our consciences from dead works that we may render sacred service to [the] living God?

¹⁵ So that is why he is a mediator of a new covenant, in order that, because a death has occurred for [their] release by ransom from the transgressions under the former covenant, the ones who have been called might receive the promise of the everlasting inheritance.” —Hebrews 9:13-15.

Does that mean that the great crowd is in heaven before God? That is what those, who believe that “only those who go to heaven are in the new covenant,” are suggesting by what they teach. But, seeing that the great crowd comes out of the great tribulation, that they will hunger no more nor thirst anymore, neither the sun beats down upon them, gives evidence that they are to “inherit the earth,” for those things pertain to the earth. (Matt. 5:5; compare Rev. 7:15-17 with 21:3,4, “the tent of God is with mankind.”) Jesus, as their mediator, will shepherd them and guide them to fountains of waters of life. (Rev. 7:17; 22:1,2)

Therefore, not only the 144,000, who will rule with Christ in the heavens, are in the new covenant, but also all those who will inherit the earth. Those, who make up the great crowd, are also “sons of Abraham” due to their faith like Abraham’s, and thus they would be included in the tribes of the sons of Israel, as Paul says at Romans 9:6. While the “great crowd” is specific to a particular time, that of those who survive the great tribulation, the tribes of the sons of Israel refers to all those who have proved to be Abraham’s sons since the first century, out of whom the 144,000 are chosen and sealed. They are also the ones Jesus said would be judged by those with whom he made a covenant for a kingdom. (Luke 22:30)

Added August 20, 2005:

Please note how The Watchtower, August 15, 2005, pages 24-29, indicates that, in connection with the new covenant, the “Israel of God” as well as the “great crowd” have God’s law inscribed in their hearts.

A Law Of Love In Hearts

4 The two tablets on which the Ten Commandments were written were placed inside the ark of the covenant within the Most Holy compartment of the tabernacle and later the temple. The laws they bore set out the core principles of the Mosaic Law covenant and formed the basis for the theocratic administration of a national government. They gave evidence that Jehovah was dealing with a specific people, a chosen people.

A Law Written in the Heart

6 Yes, those divine laws had great value. Did you know, though, that anointed Christians possess something far more valuable than laws written on stone? Jehovah foretold the making of a new covenant unlike the Law covenant made with the nation of Israel. “I will put my law within them, and in their heart I shall write it.” (Jeremiah 31:31-34) Jesus, the Mediator of the new covenant, did not personally impart a written code of law to his followers. He sounded down Jehovah’s law into the minds and hearts of his disciples by the things he said and did.

7 This law is called “the law of the Christ.” It was first given, not to the nation of natural Israel, who were the descendents of Jacob, but to a spiritual nation, “the Israel of God.” (Galatians 6:2, 16; Romans 2:28, 29) The Israel of God is made up of spirit-anointed Christians. In time, they were joined by a “great crowd” from all nations who also seek to worship Jehovah. (Revelation 7:9, 10; Zechariah 8:23) As “one flock” under “one shepherd,” both groups embrace “the law of the Christ,” allowing it to govern all that they do. —John 10:16.

8 Unlike the natural Israelites, who were bound to the Mosaic Law by birth, Christians remain under the law of the Christ by choice, factors such as race and place of birth being irrelevant. They learn about Jehovah and his ways and yearn to do his will. Having God’s law “within them,” written, as it were, “in their heart,” anointed Christians do not obey God merely because he can punish those who disobey; nor do they obey him solely out of a sense of duty. Their obedience is rooted in something more fundamental and vastly more powerful, and those of the other sheep are similarly obedient because of having God’s law in their hearts.

Love in Action

19 Many examples of self-sacrificing love may be found among Jehovah’s servants. No written law code identifies God’s people today. Instead, we see the fulfillment of what is written at Hebrews 8:10: “‘This is the covenant that I shall covenant with the house of Israel after those days,’ says Jehovah. ‘I will put my laws in their mind, and in their hearts I shall write them. And I will become their God, and they themselves will become my people.’” May we ever cherish the law of love that Jehovah has written in our hearts, taking advantage of every opportunity to demonstrate love. (Bold is mine)

Is The Watchtower saying that the great crowd is in the new covenant?

Note, it says, “Anointed Christians . . . and those of the other sheep are similarly obedient because of having God’s law in their hearts,” “both groups embrace ‘the law of the Christ.’”

Since it is Jehovah who “puts [his] law within them” and “in their heart [he] shall write it,” then it goes to reason that if he does that with the great crowd, the same as he does with anointed Christians, then both groups are included in the new covenant, since this is the outstanding feature, the core principle of the new covenant, just as “the two tablets on which the Ten Commandments were written . . . set out the core principles of the Mosaic Law covenant.”

This is evidence “that Jehovah [is] dealing with a specific people,” not just his chosen ones but also the great crowd who obey and love Jehovah, because his law is written in their hearts. They too have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb (blood of the covenant), having had their sins forgiven, and are rendering God sacred service in his temple. (Revelation 7:14, 15; compare Jeremiah 31:33, 34)